Americans have short memories when it comes to oil

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Americans have short memories when it comes to oil

Makes a mockery of all the environmently aware Prius owners. Seems nothing keeps Americans from their addictions. Just wait untill OPEC start to squeeze their pipes again. Sad, no sympathy in the future.

Who can remember all the way back to last summer, when we had daylight saving time, baseball, and $3 a gallon gasoline prices?

Not American car buyers, apparently, and you can see the evidence in the results of October auto sales

Sales of big pickup trucks and SUVs went through the roof - doubling from the year before in some cases. Sales of small, fuel efficient cars, meanwhile, remained stagnant. It is as if all that moaning and groaning about price gouging by oil companies never happened.

Actually, it is worse than that. American consumers have reinforced all the stereotypes they are labeled with: short attention spans, lack of social consciousness and thinking with their wallets.

Does anyone seriously believe that having once spiked up to $3 with very little provocation, gasoline prices won't do it again? Have they forgotten about the ongoing instability in the Middle East, where most of our oil comes from?

And have they stopped caring about traffic density, scarce resources or global warming? And if they haven't, why aren't they exercising better sense in their vehicle preferences?

 http://money.cnn.com/2006/1...
By netchicken: posted on 2-11-2006

Good call Netty.

There is just no explanation for the mindset of the masses. it's not just the gas prices either.

No one seems to be concerned in the least that the financial markets are at all time highs when the local economies are in a slump serious affecting the ability of the middle class to even keep roofs over their heads.

Nothing adds up, but it's working.
By MELtdown: posted on 2-11-2006

I see no eviodence at all about the local economy being in a slump where I live, but as far as the fuel price, I am as perplexed as Netty.
I'm not about to buy a Prius, I need more car than that, but I get dismayed when I see the "soccer mom" driving the huge SUV with nobody but her in it. To further the stereotype, she is generally driving in the passing lane (I love that as you can't see around the Metal Mountain to realize she is passing nobody) while talking on the cell phone and holding up traffic. That indicates a definite degree of self-centeredness, wouldn't you agree?

Meanwhile, China is drilling for oil 50 miles from our coast, yet our eco-freaks won't let us. The potential fuel trapped under Alaska? Untouchable. While technology has made the retrieval of oil incredibly clean nowadays, our smarter-than-thou, pious liberals would rather us financially support those who want us dead rather than get fuel from within.
By Thomas_Crowne: posted on 3-11-2006

It all comes down to "mine is bigger than yours" and "bigger is better"! ITs not like we dont remember its more like people dont want to remember because I dont think people will really want to go for small cars even if gas does to $3 a gallon because unless you live in a big city with good public transportation without a car you really cannot survive in the US. Most of the US is freeways and unlike Europe which is very densely packed the US is still very spread out and small cars are just not going to cut it when it comes down to the long drives.

Also its not like people are not being coerced into buying these monstrosities, every sports team, football match, TV show etc is sponsored by one of these SUV manufacturers. Its only natural that people would want to buy what they see. Add to this that these big hulks now are pretty affordable and come packed with lots of incentives like cheap insurance, etc so its pretty enticing to say the least.
By IAF: posted on 3-11-2006

I have to agree with IAF. What I am seeing HUGH amounts of are Hummers. They must be giving those suckers away.
By Venus: posted on 3-11-2006

Well, I for one just gave up my fully loaded Altima for a used bare bones Saturn, solely cause I hate stopping to fill my tank and now I can go two weeks without doing so. :dbguy

Everyone thinks I'm nuts, but if it weren't for the fact that I just don't want to be making payments on depreciable items, I would have gone for the Prius.

I do just love it when people who have vehicles twice the size of what they even need whining about their gas expenses - hello????

The local economy where I am is in a slump, it was highly dependant on the building market. I am in Property Management now (rentals) and we are seeing a lot of evictions due to inability to pay, people unable to qualify for rentals without getting the owners to cut them some precarious breaks, people who are asking us to find new tenants for their units cause they can't afford it anymore, and getting new rentals from people who have lost their homes to foreclosure. However, even here, those who aren't in this business don't realize yet what is happening. It came on pretty quick and the repercussions are going unnoticed so far.

I do think people are being blind eyed about it. They just don't want to know.
By MELtdown: posted on 5-11-2006

Great post meltdown!

I imagine that being on the coal face, so to speak, of housing, that you would be one of the first industries to notice any changes in the economy, long before the average person on the street notices anything.

It a wonder that there arn't some stats floating around looking at things like you mention.
By netchicken: posted on 5-11-2006

... Quote:
Originally posted by netchicken
It a wonder that there arn't some stats floating around looking at things like you mention.


There are plenty of articles out there right now regarding the housing situation and it's repercussions Net:

 http://www.moneyweek.com/fi...

... Quote:
But I've got news for you: The speed with which housing prices will fall in 2007 will dwarf that of this year. Here's why...
First of all, there is an oversupply of homes on the market.
Second, builders have not yet finished projects that were begun six months ago when all was rosy.
Third, sellers are still wishing and hoping they can sell their houses to the "right" buyer for the "right" price next week. Just like the Nasdaq collapse earlier this decade, homeowners are prone to overly optimistic projected outcomes in their personal situation.

...

That's because right now, sellers aren't selling. They're in denial - still waiting for Santa to deliver their asking price... or close to it. But when homeowners finally adjust to the prices that reflect the marketplace reality, bolt the door - because prices will fall like dominos.



Here's an article from the other side of the country, but it might as well be describing what I'm seeeing in Florida:

 http://patrick.net/housing/...

... Quote:
Salary declines. From http://www.mccallstaffing.c... we hear that Bay Area "salaries have in fact returned to 1997 and 1998 levels." Household incomes are not even half of what they need to be to sustain current house prices.

....

Extreme use of leverage. Leverage means using debt to amplify gain. Most people forget that losses get amplified as well. If a buyer puts 10% down and the house goes down 10%, he has lost 100% of his money on paper. If he has to sell due to job loss or an interest rate hike, he's bankrupt in the real world.
It's worse than that. House prices do not even have to fall to cause big losses. The cost of selling a house is 6%. On a $600,000 house, that's $36,000 lost even if prices just stay flat. So a 4% decline in housing prices bankrupts all those with 10% equity or less.


Shortage of first-time buyers. According to the California Association of Realtors, the percentage of Bay Area buyers who could afford a median-price house in the region plunged from 20 percent in July 2003 to 14 percent in July 2004. Strangely, the CAR then reported that affordability fell another 4 percent in 2005, yet claims affordability is still at 14%.

Surplus of speculators. Nationally, 25% of houses bought in 2005 were pure speculation, not houses to live in. It is now possible to buy a house with 103% financing. The extra 3% is to cover closing costs, so the speculator needs no money down. Even the National Association of House Builders admits that "Investor-driven price appreciation looms over some housing markets."

Trouble at the builders. They are being forced to drop prices even faster than owners. They overbuilt and have huge excess inventory that they cannot sell at current prices.


There are articles like this going back to earlier this year, and yet everyone is in a state of denial. Gas is the least of their worries. As for short term memories, I am dumbfounded at the people who lived through the last severe housing crash in the 80's totally forgetting the financial markets follow the housing market (but apparently with a 6 month lag). The US financial markets are at all time highs and the average Joe (encouraged by their government telling them the economy is in great shape) wants to look at this and only this to say everything is fine. They also seem to think the previously rising gas prices caused the problem so now that the gas prices have fallen everything will return to normal. Don't count on it.
By MELtdown: posted on 5-11-2006

they are a pack of goats netchicken, nothing but goats.

kids grow up into goats, they dont even understand the metric
system that is why they went back to miles. Mentality of goats
most likely why they dont use the word children any more
because they are a pack of goats and kids grow up in to goats.

America is a evil country were they like killing others at school, like
saying it is safer to be away from school and soon you will grow
from a kid in to a real goat.
By Richard Principal: posted on 6-11-2006

Really swell response, Dick.
Here's what I got out of your post.....
You think intelligence is measured by metric stick,
You watch too much CNN and should be more concerned about your own nation than trying to paint my very large and very populated country with the broad brush,
and.....
most importantly.....
to use "an" before a word that starts with a vowel!

:dbguy

By the way, Dick, of what glorious and perfect nation to you claim to be a part?
By Thomas_Crowne: posted on 6-11-2006

Wow Mr. Principal, I hope you aren't in my school district with that attitude - ROTF.

Let's just remember kids come form somewhere and that's where the blame lies.

As for the propblem being confined to the US, just keep telling yourself that if you aren't here and it makes you feel better. But if you can handle the truth, those lines on the map are not some magic field that keeps things self contained.

There is a world wide degeneration and if those of you not from the US don't see it, well then you just can't handle the truth.;)
By MELtdown: posted on 6-11-2006

According to his web address it appears Mr. Principal is another kiwi. Isn't there some saying about there being more sheep there than people? Perhaps he's just jealous.;)
By Venus: posted on 6-11-2006

Hmm Mr Principal is entirely the author and believer of his own posts, he does not represent the Kiwi mentality on this topic.

I have a great liking of Americans, they are very creative, friendly and never a dull moment, turn your back for a minute and before you know it they are off blowing up some third world country :)

:ba:ba:ba

Heck without America what on earth would we watch on TV? Old British comedy shows? Lithuanian dramas? Australian soap operas (arrgghh)
By netchicken: posted on 6-11-2006

what an bunch of snooty nose brats. that have repiled here.

... Quote:
I have a great liking of Americans
I have an great liking of Americans too, they are better than say Indians from India or some "know all" POMES, just because you lot (from USA land) can not spell C H I L D R E N there is not need to get personnel,

I have never had an dig at any other member of this forum. and I am not having an dig at any one member


... Quote:
Heck without America what on earth would we watch on TV?

TV would be an lot better without all that shit, it is just endless crap, it was great back in the days of "The Beverly Hillbillies", "Get smart" "Hogans heroes" just to mention three there was many many more, but today the only thing that gets an laugh is the "canned laugher" and simpson that cheap crap they can not even draw people properly.
By Richard Principal: posted on 7-11-2006

Dang baby, settle down!

We Americans know you folks just don't know any better.:)
By Venus: posted on 7-11-2006

"WKRP in Cincinnati" was a great comedy back in the days when US turned out great comedy.
By Richard Principal: posted on 7-11-2006

Did you see the one where they were giving away live turkeys for Thanksgiving.....dropping them from a helicopter...LMAO.....:worm
By Venus: posted on 7-11-2006

Yes!

That was my favorite line from the show, with the shocked reporter's narrative and the guy saying "How should I know Turkeys couldn't fly" :tu:tu:tu
By netchicken: posted on 7-11-2006

CLASSIC!

...was that the same one when the boss guy was using cocaine as footpowder?
By Venus: posted on 7-11-2006

Speaking of turkeys....
Dick, you took a swipe at members and you are cognizant enough to know that!

If you were here in Alabama I'd grab my AK, find you and.....
take you target shooting so that you could become familiar with the weapon, learn how fun it is to shoot and explain to you world history and why it has been proven time and time again how important it is that civilians be armed.

Personally, I liked Wings, but I don't know if you remember that particular sitcom.
By Thomas_Crowne: posted on 7-11-2006

... Quote:
Originally posted by Thomas_Crowne

If you were here in Alabama I'd grab my AK, find you and.....
take you target shooting so that you could become familiar with the weapon, learn how fun it is to shoot and explain to you world history and why it has been proven time and time again how important it is that civilians be armed.


I think I read somewhere that Dick Cheney used that same line:P
By Venus: posted on 7-11-2006

Omgosh omgosh omgosh!!

We're sliding off topic. *wonders how to handle this*.

I think I need an ATS deprogramming intervention.

*cowers in corner* :j:f
By MELtdown: posted on 7-11-2006

There we go!!!
Perfect proof that not all Americans have short memories, meltdown remembered the orginal purpose in the thread!
:guy:guy:guy
(better than the rest of us off road debaters)

Back to the topic now everyone, which is, um, something about cars.... I think ...

... Quote:
Originally posted by MELtdown
Omgosh omgosh omgosh!!

We're sliding off topic. *wonders how to handle this*.

I think I need an ATS deprogramming intervention.

*cowers in corner* :j:f
By netchicken: posted on 7-11-2006

I drive a small SUV, and am what you might call a "Gashole", however, I like to soothe my conscience the following ways:

1. I live in Canada, land of forest, snow, and more forest.
2. While I do in fact live in Toronto, Canada's most populous and polluted city, I don't drive during the week. I use my very own two little feet, or if need be, the wonderful subways that grace Toronto's downtown, where I reside.
3. When I do drive, I use my vehicles capabilities to the fullest. She's a nice ride, has balls, and takes me where I need to go, on road or off, long trips or short, sun or moonshine, rain or snow. This is the time of year when she's particularly useful: 4x4 is my best friend come December on, when the snow piles up, the roads get bad and I don't feel like sitting home twiddling my thumbs.

:dbguy
By parrhesia: posted on 7-11-2006

I don't drive in moonshine; the local cops love setting up road blocks.

I feel I am doing a little to help as I am driving slower and, while I enjoyed my old job more, my newer job (of 2 1/2 years) is 40 miles closer.

If my car ever dies (I really doubt it will judging by its 170k track record and the fact that it is doing as well as it did 150k ago) I plan on getting something that will do much better than 28 mpg.

As I pointed out in the other similar thread, there are environmental concerns much more troubling than this politicized one, but I don't like paying the enemy to kill those I love. Those I don't love, even.
By Thomas_Crowne: posted on 7-11-2006








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